Robin Hood 1973

Ashia R: It’s family movie night!

Tonight we’re watching the 1973 movie ‘Robin Hood’ – the one with the weirdly sexy* anthropomorphic fox.

I’ll be ranting with ramming commentary as we watch the movie to see how it holds up. 

*(I would totally still hit that)

Coding & Accents

…Why does the ‘medieval minstrel’ turkey narrator…why does he have a southern accent?

Little John has a northern American accent, and Robin Hood has a British accent. This is a multinational gaggle of folks.

Dude with a British accent: ”We never rob. Simply borrow a bit from those who can afford it.”Interesting to see how the media of our childhoods reinforced the idea that if you do anything, no matter how devious, it’s all kind of benevolent if it comes with a British accent.

Queer-Coding & The Evil Gay Agenda

I don’t know why, but when I was little, Little John, Prince John, and King Richard coded as Black to me. And now that I know about queer coding, I’m seeing how Prince John & Sir Hiss code as The Evil Gay.

Q wants to know why the hand of the king is always able to hypnotize people (I think he’s referencing Aladdin – another story featuring the Evil Gay Agenda trope).

I always felt bad for the way PJ treats sir Hiss. Poor Hiss. He’s just doing his job. 

Thinking on what Q said re: Evil Hypnotic Hands of the King. I know I’ve seen mentions for both Jafar and Sir Hiss coding as queer. And I’m wondering – is this supposed to reinforce the idea of a ‘gay agenda’ like the Evil Gays are trying to lure straight folks into a lifestyle of queerness? SIN AND SATAN! (Also sarcasm.)

Problematic Gender Nonsense

Oh here we go! Men dressing as women for comedic humor.

“Bobbycock. Female bandits? What’s next? Rubbish.” – Oh, that’s interesting. Taking advantage of the stereotype of women as powerless caretakers and that assumption (that we maintain through today) that women aren’t capable of harm.

Narrow Masculinity – Be Daring, Maybe Do Chores If No Women Are There To Do It For You, Don’t Whine, NO CRYING

Prince John doing the sucking his thumb and calling for his mommy: reinforcing the idea that men who love their moms and have feelings and ask for help are weak, greedy, and pathetic. We’re discussing how it’s totally okay to suck your thumb, and how there’s no shame in finding oral stims comforting. 

Aaand now Lady Cluck making fun of Prince John’s crying and calling for his mom. Because there is no better way to break down a man than to show how he still cares about his mom.

Toby the nervous turtle with glasses, reminding kids not to be a killjoy *or be careful or think before acting.

Little John does his own damn laundry.  He’s also comfortable enough in his masculinity to wear a frilly apron. I had a crush on the wrong furry.

Yeah that scene with the chores just completely changed me. Nevermind the fox – give me the sexy bear who pulls his own weight in the laundry room.

Discussing with Nathan how my crush has switched to Little John. Nathan used to have a crush on Marian – but now that we’re watching this movie he’s realized how much sexier Lady Cluck is. 

Which is nice because I definitely resemble Lady Cluck (both in sturdy chicken-esque shape and joyful aggression) more than willowy, demure Marian.

Trickster Foxes & Anti-Colonialism

In terms of the message on taxes: Where it’s the state that is overtaxing the public – Interesting to see how we perpetuate this idea of rebellion against over-taxation as a call against socialism and social support.

I can see how a generation of kids would grow up seeing government taxation as greed of the wealthy if this is the way we’re teaching kids how taxes work. And the ‘good guy’ is the person who eludes the IRS and steals from the government. Hmm.

So when I was little my mom tied this to the imprisonment of Irish who couldn’t afford to pay taxes to the British colonizers and how we ended up getting shipped to Australia and the US because they couldn’t fit us in the prisons.

And it’s kind of messed up how much nicer this jail is than the actual for-profit prisons we now have in place in the US. Did they actually collect taxes from churches back then? Cause they sure don’t now.

Also wondering how this works on the timeline of the church control on the British government.

Shannon B.S.: I just read this essay about it and it definitely influenced how I talked to my kids about it. (We haven’t watched it in a long time, but it was my husband’s favorite movie as a kid and we were thinking about watching it soon.) We also talked about how foxes in old English stories are often trickster characters, as we also just watched Fantastic Mr. Fox.

Essay excerpt: “The nobility are portrayed as obviously foreign tropical animals (lions, rhinos, snakes) while Robin Hood and co are either indigenous to the island or domesticated. The story of the French-speaking ruling classes and their indigenous subjects is thus narrated via the animal kingdom and the film gets an anti-colonial theme.“ 

Ashia: Solid! Trickster foxes in East Asian stories too.

Maura Kate M. The shady fox theme plays out in Zootopia (another movie that I wanted to love, but let me down in big ways)

Ashia R. This is weird how the end is just magically a pardon with King Richard showing up. Back to monarchy, except I guess we’re supposed to be okay if it’s a benevolent dictator.

Roma Stereotypes

OH I SEE. Robin & Little John are playing into the gypsy-as-charlatans thing. Which I feel like is still acceptable in today’s stories stigmatizing the Roma.

::Pausing the movie to tell the kids to watch out for racist Roma tropes:::

Classism

Sheriff also has a southern accent. Not sure what you call it. It’s the one northerners use to make fun of uneducated white southerners. Classism!

Interesting to see how the ‘nice’ folks – (Little John, the friar) have northern American accents.

::Pausing to discuss Northern classism and stigma against Rural Southerners:::

Again with the jokes about ignorant Southern Americans, Nutsy is not quite with the program. 

I get it, (and as an ADULT, I like it) – how Robin & LJ take advantage of cultural bias (and costumes) to con their way around power and aggression. 

This movie taught me that I could disguise myself as another person if I just wore the right outfit and put on an accent. I JUST NOW REALIZED that I was NOT fooling my mom at all. 

And now Robin, in his disguise of a ‘nobody’ picks up a poor British accent (Cockney?) to go along with that theme of being unimportant and not worth paying attention to. More classism! But also more taking advantage of folks’ classist assumptions!

I mean on one hand – if the viewer is adept enough at picking up that these cons work BECAUSE the person in power is a bigot, that’s great! But also this is a movie for kids. And for me – the message I got wasn’t that ‘haha Prince John and the Sheriff of Nottingham are getting what’s coming to them because they are bigots’ but ‘people with southern accents are uneducated buffoons.’ Because ultimately, the smart person who does the tricking has that genteel British accent – and kids know that. So this isn’t so much a ‘folks in power make a wrong assumption about accents and class’ so much as ‘British people are clever.’

Oh here’s the Irish accent: Robin’s blind beggar disguise. Add disabled folks’ to the list of people we taught kids were harmless. Again – I get what he was trying to do, but ultimately Robin is sighted and this dehumanizes folks with disabilities.

This movie could be SO GOOD with adults watching alongside kids and discussing the themes. Or go SO WRONG if not.

If Prince John Lived in 2020 he’d be on Twitter CONSTANTLY

PJ’s tantrums feel oddly relevant in today’s moment of having a leader who stomps his feet and throws a twitter tantrum every time we challenge his power.  “

The jails are full” is supposed to comfort PJ. Which sounds a lot like the folks who find comfort in filling our jails as if that somehow makes us safer instead of less safe. Now, in keeping with the Sheriff (police) as supporting the wealthy dudes in power, I can get behind those boos.

PJ sleeping hugging his bags of money is how I picture basically all rich white men as they slumber

Evidence: I sleep next to a white dude and he basically does this, but cradles his expensive iphone instead of bags of cash.

Nathan R: “Do you think the president watched this movie as a kid and identified with prince john?” 

Aaaand now we’re seeing that the only way to control an authoritarian uncontrollable temperamental dictator is to threaten him. Oh gosh. 

Body Acceptance

I do remember watching this movie as a kid and being surprised at the normalization of larger body types.

Like – Little John (as a lady) is playing the honeypot and it’s totally expected that he’d be damn sexy with all those curves.

And I remember that being weird because everything around me (at the ripe age of like 5), told me that we can only be beautiful or desirable when our bodies take up as little space as possible.

Lady Cluck’s body – losing a badminton birdie in her cleavage, because fat people are so fat you can lose stuff in there! HA! (This is sarcasm.)

Although I do love Lady Cluck and the fact that she had so many lines in this movie without existing as a sex object (but she’s still desirable, if I remember correctly).

Note on the guards, little John, the friar, and Lady Cluck: Fat people appear to ALWAYS be the backup sidekick.

Maid Marian the sex object: the pure classy virgin & also a pedophile?

“She’s a highball lady of quality” (whatever that means) ‘Cause Marian is thin, doesn’t do much and she’s rich. Get it?

Her currency is right up there in the first scene with her in it. Her beauty. Her role as a sweetheart and object of Robin’s affection. I remember being confused about what she DOES exactly, other than waiting around for men?

Do we ever figure out why Marian is hanging out with PJ? This was always unclear to me.

Sharon C. B. I think they’re cousins? Family living together? This was my favorite movie as a kid. Everything else Disney was too scary. I’m enjoying the comments 🙂

Shannon B. S. I think she’s a member of the court, probably the daughter of someone important. Hanging around the king basically was a job in and of itself.

Ashia R.: And of course, folks ask her if she’s gonna have any kids. Does anyone ever ask Robin if he’s gonna have any kids?

Whoa is Maid Marian grooming this little rabbit kid? 

She suggests he give her a kiss. He says ‘that’s sissy stuff’ (obvs wow problematic.) But then she pulls him into a kiss without his consent and he does NOT look happy about it.

And then his friends laugh at him for getting assaulted by this strange woman they just met.

HOLY SHIT.

“Run for it lassie, this is no place for a lady” says Lady Cluck. And I remember being SO confused about why LADY Cluck, in her curves and intelligence and humor, doesn’t count as a lady. Marian pick up a damn sword! She’s just standing there! 

Okay I did love this scene as a kid of Lady Cluck plowing through this giant pile of rhinos. Badass.

R2 is scared about what happens. But we’re reassured that unlike the horror-show ending of tangled, no one dies, no one’s hair is cut without their consent, and no one is forced into marriage after years of grooming. 

Although I’ve got my eye on Marian, that child predator. 

I remember, for a long time, wondering if love and marriage is for sissies, why is Robin’s happy ending to get married to this lady who just kind of does nothing (except for molesting children).

Huh, I could have sworn Lady Cluck hooks up with Little John, but I guess not. The end!

Maura Kate M. Oh, I’m so cranky that I missed this! I would have watched and reviewed with you! #GetOutOfMyBrain!